This topic contains 31 replies, has 23 voices, and was last updated by  jon 1 year, 7 months ago.

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  • #12031

    This topic shows comments from the Public Networks page – add your message to the thread below.

  • #18425


    I live near Morrisons on chesterfield road, sheffield but notice this is not on the zap map why is this it does make me wonder how many more there are that are not listed as there seems to be so few in south yorkshire- sheffield and chesterfield where we live it would be good to know other than trawling round how many there really are about. we are about to pick up our nissan leaf tekna this week and am a little apprehensive, thanks Gail

    • #18487

      Hi Gail

      Sorry to hear that the Morrisons point is not on our map, we would really like to add this charge point if you could provide the necessary details through our Add a Charge Point Form.

      Zap-Map Live is the most comprehensive and accurate charging map in the UK and whilst the objective is to have every publicly available point listed, given the changeable and fragmented nature of the market, maintaining an accurate database is challenging; feedback from users is critical to keep the data as up to date as possible.

      With our Add a Charge Point Form and the ability to report updates on specific points, we welcome this all important user feedback, which will be reviewed by our data manager before being uploaded on to the map.

      I hope that you enjoy your new Nissan LEAF and please feel fee to contact us with any further questions/feedback.

      Many thanks

      Ed (Zap-Map)

  • #19047


    If its like the Morrisons at Elland near Halifax West Yorkshire they won’t have a clue.

    I have been asking the store and their head office for over a month now and no one can tell me who operates it or how to use it – unbeliveable!

    Its not the operator on the sticker on the post. I contacted them and they said it was not one of theirs.

    Richard W. – Ampera Owner.

  • #22036



    I think your website is really good and easy to use and with the mobile app makes it the ultimate tool for an EV driver. I was wondering though whether you could add a new filter to your map search? You have the different power outages and then the type of charge point but was wondering if it would be possible to add a supplier filter? E.g Ecotricity, pod point search?

    I feel that many would benefit from this filter especially those going on long trips who may just want to use the Ecotricity charge points.

    Thanks for taking the time to read my comment and keep up the good work.


  • #22207


    General rant – not aimed at you guys at all!

    Having been a Leaf owner for 2-1/2 months, and having friends in the US who’ve had one for 4-1/2 years, I’m absolutely flabbergasted at the appalling mess of the UK public charging network in comparison to California.

    In the US you simply swipe your credit card. No messing around with pre-registering and pre-paying on multiple different networks. Charge points WORK.

    In the last week I’ve tried to use the SSE network: one worked, one silently failed, and the Polar: two failed, and on calling their helpline the duty chap said “the mobile app doesn’t work, ask the office for a card”. That would be the office that denied that they used cards at all–. Both these still show up as “available” on their maps many hours later – and the engineer wasn’t due to attend for “about 48 hours”.

    The only network that seems to work is Ecotricity, but the user interface on their points is needlessly complex (one small plus point there to SSE, theirs is much better: press one button, swipe your card, plug in). Not great, it’s still slow and hard to use – see next two paragraphs!

    ALL the charge points have a glaring (literally) flaw: the displays are feeble, have no shading, and are unreadable in direct sun. I can safely say that CA tends to be sunnier than the UK. No problem, the points (which incidentally are *much* smaller and neater) are all designed so you can see what’s going on.

    Oh yes: they don’t take 2-3 minutes to “communicate with the vehicle” after you plug in. A couple of seconds is all.

    All in all, unless and until the various operators sort themselves out they are going to seriously hamper EV takeup. If I was an EV manufacturer I’d be very annoyed!

    Trouble is, there are lots of companies building these networks, and they mostly seem to use the same charge point hardware, so it looks like we are stuck with this.

  • #22555


    We have a VW e-UP! [ V Yorkshire] & have just made 1st trip ‘abroad’ since collecting it 3 months ago. Sheffield to N Devon & Somerset. Planned route reqd use of motorways for Service Station hops. Ecotricity all the way to M5 junction with A361 Tiverton. Used CCS 50kW rapid chargers [swipe card for free] – excellent. Tiverton only had CCS 43kW AC Type 2. For 50% charge it took 2 1/2 hrs! Otherwise, mission successfully & satisfyingly completed over a week.

    I now learn from VW that the 43kW AC chargers may potentially damage the drive battery, affecting the validity of the warranty! The limit for the VW EV’s appears to be Type 2 7kW-22kW, or in other measures, 16A-32A AC. The CCS 50kW DC is apparently perfectly satisfactory.
    VW owners need to be aware.
    Perhaps Ecotricity cd install more CCS 50kW rapid chargers & start making a small charge, or subscription service to cover their costs?


  • #22759


    Hi Edward, great work on this site!

    I posted a few weeks ago about the general mess of the UK public networks.

    I wonder if there is, anywhere, a public forum that will get these issues noticed. Thinking of writing to Nissan UK MD, at least they have a vested interest in fixing this mess, even if it’s not their fault.

    More experiences:

    1: Some of the points listed in your map – and the in-car map in Leafs – either don’t exist, are not accessible to the public, or are so well hidden they may as well not exist.

    2: Chargemaster/Polar in particular are very good at siting their 3/7Kw units so a single parked car hides them. We need a standard sign for all charge points – there’s already a good logo,the fuel pump with a plug.

    3: Chargemaster/Polar again: the mobile app is CRAP: if it works it takes minutes to do so, is utterly uninformative, and on one occasion last weekend the car got so confused that it turned on by itself and would not turn off (note to call Nissan, some software glitch?). Their answer is their subscription service, but that means a regular payment for a service I will use very occasionally.

    4: No joined up thinking. Going to Cambridge next weekend, and find there’s lots of public points there. Almost all operated by “Charge East”, which requires an annual subscription. So for the occasional visitor, not very useful.

    5: Still finding points that are out of service far more than seems reasonable, and it’s not vandalism. I can’t see how anyone could vandalise a rapid charge unit without leaving very visible damage (and probably killing yourself!)

    This is the equivalent of having to buy prepaid/subscription cards for each fuel vendor (Shell, Texaco, Tesco etc), and then finding some sites closed, some missing, some hidden, and then working out which site has a nozzle that matches your car, and hoping it will be working.

    All in all, this is completely counterproductive to encouraging EV use.

    On three out of three longer trips (IE >80 miles round trip) with my wife we have got into extended “find a point we can actually get to work” mode, and she now flatly refuses to use the car if there is any chance of needing to charge on the go. That means local trips only. She is by no means a technophobe.

    I have 30+ years in the computer industry in engineering roles,and I have never seen such a mess. It’s easy to have multiple competing vendors, but they must make it simple to use, with common controls. The car industry worked this out 100 years ago when Cadillac invented the standard 3 pedal system.

  • #22805


    Hi All,

    Love Zap-Map – particularly the mobile app which has helped me out a few times 🙂 ! Being a pure EV driver covering relatively high mileage (heading for 30k miles this year in my Model S) I have to wonder about what will happen to charge point availability when the next raft of plug-in hybrids (PHEVs) hit the roads…

    I have never (so far) had to wait for a charger or had real issues finding a suitable charging station in the southern half of the country (just plan your trip and be sure to know where there are alternatives) but I am fairly sure that we will see problems soon with PHEVs clogging up public charging stalls… I am lucky in that I can usually use a Tesla Supercharger on route but many times we rely on a CHADEMO or similar near our destination if overnight top-up is not possible.

    Does anyone have any information as to the likely rollout of (and provider/local authority support for) the additional higher power charging stations that are going to be needed over the next year or two? I would like to think that this is all being planned for but news is a bit thin on the ground!

  • #23141


    Plugged in Midlands is no longer £24 pe year but £7.85 per month (£94 per year). Perhaps this should be updated?

  • #24445


    As a prospective Nissan Leaf owner in Norfolk I naturally went onto the SourceEast website to register for a swipe card. Unfortunately many of the website pages are unavailable including the registration page – “HTTP 404 Not Found” error.
    I did contact support who emailed back saying it was all working but obviously isn’t.
    Is their a problem with SourceEast? Has anyone recently successfully registered for one of their cards?
    Any news gratefully received.

  • #24975


    Group, do you guys know what charging network is represented by the Zap-Map acronym of DBTDQ?

    Planning a trip from London down south and don’t want to show up at a charging point only to realise it’s a network of which I’m not a member.

    Thanks a lot!

  • #25120

    Hi Sergei

    DBTDQ are DBT Rapid chargers and typically installed by Ecotricity network. On the Info Box on a point, click on the “i” tab and it will tell you which network operates the point.

    Thanks Melanie (Zap-Map)

  • #25237


    I fortunately have access at present to free charging through Ireland at present ,however this will not remain so for much longer and as its free I will put up with glitches in the infrastructure but as it gets busier and faults not resolved may become more frustrating

    Examples charging post in local outlet area appears to not like my Zoe for some months now
    Blame the car appears to be the come back when trying to resolve , never had that at traditional garage
    Not sure how most ev newbies would take that

    If we end up with cars working with infrastructure as PCs work ev sales will stall
    Charging must be more robust , and putting problems back to ev owner will make will put off transition further from other forms

    End of rant , love ev , infrastructure will need to keep pace with sales

    As many in uk pay and soon Ireland will be paying , and in the case of Ireland proposed payment scheme put back due to protesting price structure 16.99 euro a month plan upfront for total use of fast chargers , and super fast charged on time 30 cents per minute those in charge must not drive ev as the flaws in this easily seen , I digress this has not come into operation and as I in uk end of Ireland not sure on procedures up north even time bringing in charging but if can’t use a charger would be angry ev users , like having empty petrol stations though u paid up front for fuel

  • #26986


    I contacted a York hotel , whose charging point is on the public access map , and was told that the ev charge point was for residents only
    have I misunderstood the meaning of public access , or is the hotel incorrect in its advice?
    many thanks

    • #26987

      Hi chargedog, could you provide me with the name and postcode of the device and I will look into this further?

  • #27021


    Best Western Monkbar Hotel – St Maurice’s Road, York, YO31 7JA

    • #27024

      Hi Chargedog, it appears to be for patrons staying at the hotel only. Apologies for any inconvenience caused.

  • #27049


    Hi , thinking of buying a Leaf , currently on my first day of a weeks test drive, does anyone know if i can still claim the 45p for the first 10,000 miles and 25p for every mile after that from my company as i am using it for work ? i cant see anything on the government web sites to say i cant

    Any info would be appreciated

  • #27050


    I have claimed the 45p rate on a few occasions, but probably less than 100 miles in all. I don’t think HMRC has caught up with EVs yet. Of course, what your employer might think is another matter!

  • #27679


    I discovered today that not all Polar chargepoints are available through the Polar Instant PAYG app. Some, such as the one at postcode B14 7BH, don’t show up on the Polar Instant app because they are only available to people who join Polar Plus (a subscription service). It would help others if you could make this clear in your explanation of the Polar network above.

  • #27746


    Is it possible to search for hotels with charge points as i travel around the country and look for hotels with a charging facility but there still doesn’t seem to be an easy way to search either through yourselves or even on hotel websites?

  • #27788

    Jolly Green John

    Following the introduction of charging at the Ecotricity rapid charge points, I decided to switch over to Ecotricity. To save money, I need to use most of my allowed 52 free charges during the year, but I like the fact that they are producing all their power from renewable resources, so for me that is a plus

    However, I think for longer journeys, new strategies are required to minimise the times I use Ecotricity points. I quite often use “Eco routes” from the Leaf SATNAV, rather than fastest routes, and can normally squeeze out 95 miles on a charge. But now I am now looking for “cost effective” routes as well

    This is more of a manual task, searching out free and low cost chargers on suitable (alternative) routes. Of course, for leaf owners there are the friendly Nissan garages, Zero net is often free (but they are not fast charges), as are some Polar charge points (apart from the connection fee for “instant”). It is out of my usual area, but it looks like source london is also cheap to use, and of course there are a few other open access points without charge.

    Also normally I set off on a route with a full charge, but this may not be the best strategy. I arrive at many of the rapid chargers I use, needing only a top up toget to destination. My new strategy will involve trying to arrive with around 20%, to get close to the maximum kWh from a 30 minute charge.

    With planning I hope the leaf will still prove cost effective as well as pleasing to drive for the vast majority of my driving requirements, but I am looking forward to the day they bring out one with 200 plus mile range.

    If anyone has any other cost saving tips, would be great to hear

    My daily commute is simple however – 30 miles round trip, very average. But I pass each day an Ecotricity point that is visible from the M27. It used to be regularly occupied by a Leaf or a mitsubishi PHEV. Since the charge came in, I have not seen it in use once. For the PHEVs, the petrol is cheaper.

  • #28005


    Hate to be a naysayer and nasty PHEV owner to boot, but at the moment there is no such thing as green electricity. All electricity supplies come from the National Grid whether it be EDF, E-on, Ecotricity or whoever. I see constant cries of “OH but we’re totally green!!”, but unless they have their own nationwide grid there is absolutely no possibility of totally green electricity for anyone.
    This brings me to the point of EV vs PHEV. I use a PHEV (Outlander to be precise) simply because there are no range problems should I be away from charge points. IF i could afford it……… and it’s a mighty big if being a disabled pensioner……..I wouldn’t hesitate to buy a Tesla. The Leaf just hasn’t got the room or capability to carry a large, heavy mobility scooter without large restrictions on range, and the same with other models.
    I live in Norfolk, and apart from Swaffham, the nearest Chademo point is Peterborough. I do attempt to use the car in electric mode as much as possible. However even that option is now greatly reduced by Ecotricity’s shennigans of the last months. Don’t get me wrong…… I pay, sometimes handsomely ( get round the Gloucester/Worcester and some of Essex areas and watch your eyes pop as you realise the price 🙂 I have RFID for CYC, Polar and apps for Podpoint amongst the others, and don’t object to paying, except when we’re speaking 25p kw/hr upwards PLUS parking of £4 or £5..

  • #28664


    Although Jon (Aug 22nd) is correct in saying that we all use the same National Grid for electricity, we can in fact use green (renewable) electricity if we are customers of Ecotricity, Green Energy and other renewable electricity suppliers. The way it works is that these suppliers match the electricity they generate (from solar, wind, hydro-electric etc) to the amount of electricity that their customers consume.
    It may be fair to say that, some of the time, those customers may be using use more than their renewable suppliers are generating. Conversely some of the time the renewable companies will be generating more than their customers are using (when it’s very windy and very sunny for example). But overall the generation and consumption are pretty well matched.
    To have a strict match of renewable generation and consumption AT THE SAME TIME would be difficult and would mean generators (wind turbines and solar panels) would have to be turned off when renewable customers are not using much electricity, which would obviously be wasteful of good supplies of wind and sunlight, and also mean that more fossil fuels would have to be burned than necessary during these times. This would make no sense economically or environmentally.
    As it is, the mix of renewable and fossil fuels electricity supporting each other when there is an excess, or an under-supply, of sun and wind works well I think.
    Personally, in addition to buying electricity from Ecotricity, I have solar panels on my roof and make an effort to charge my car when the sun is shining as far as possible.
    I also walk around wearing a halo obviously 🙂

  • #28683


    I still find the argument you put forward puzzling ecoAndrew. As I undertsand the grid ALL generated electricty ends up there, therefore we all use a mix whether or no we’re Ecotricity customers.
    I get the feeling I’m being sold the old three card trick
    .Let’s assume the grid to be a jar of a liquid……beer mayhap…….with several inputs……..Fosters. Ind Coope, Marstons, Bass, Worthington and Joe’s private brewery from down the street shall we say. There is one delivery tap. Open that tap and I get a mix………’s inseperable. I could no more claim I used exclusively small brewery real ale than I could claim I walk on water..
    The same applies to the National Grid. many suppliers, green and non-green, fill it’s “jar”. There is one metered “tap” out of which comes the mix of all types of generated electricity. We all use green generated electricity whether we be with E-on, Ecotricity, British Gas or whoever to the same degree.
    It’s not possible, UNLESS there’s a totally separate green generation and supply grid ( Home wind turbine,solar panels etc.for example), for anyone to claim they use green electricity solely or indeed for any company to advertise the fact that they sell only green electricity FROM the National Grid. They may sell it to the national grid but the customer at point of sale most certainly doesn’t get pure green, no matter the protestations of the green generator companies
    I appreciate the argument that the green generators supply only green electricity to the grid, however it gets sorta diluted so they do not sell exclusively green electricity to the retail customer.
    I stand by my original point that at this moment in time there is no such thing as green electricity. to the mass martket. I’ll add “until we have a green National Grid and separation of generated supplies” to it if it helps any.
    Oh, and just in case you should think I’m a less than knowledgable on matters environmental and ecological, I own patents and copyrights in the designs of fuel efficient engines, and was involved in designing pure and hybrid hyrdrogen fuelled vehicles, plus hybrid and full EV, and have been deeply involved in such matters since the 1980s…… a long, long time before the present “green revolution” started down it’s path.

  • #28684


    Its quite simple really.

    Yes, all generated electricity ends up in the grid so you cannot separate the electrons pushed in by Green or other sources.

    The point is that Ecotricity generate enough ‘Green’ power to cover their customers consumption. As their customer base grows their generation capacity grows.

    Ergo, if you are an Ecotricity customer you can quite legitimately claim to only use Green electricity.

    Not sure where the confusion is…?

  • #28685


    Simple??? Confusion?? Not in my mind. Green energy is the way forward. However, dubious statements and false hypothetical arguments do the cause no good at all.

    Ecotricity plus all other renewable and sustainable source generation = 11.7% of the total electricity generated in the UK.
    That 11.7% is added to the 25.1% nuclear generated and 63.2% fossil fuel generated output and made available of the National Grid.
    Ecotricity customers are connected to the National grid. You are an Ecotricity customer I’d guess. What comes out of your electrical sockets? Is it any different to the stuff that comes out of mine?
    Please explain to me how, as Ecotricity have no seperate and individual grid of their own, you are “legitimately” claiming you are using soley green electricity? Hypothetically is the word I’d use, not legitimately.
    You are using precisely 11.7% green electricity, as is every other National Grid supplied customer in the UK.
    When the national grid is 100% green then , and only then, will you be able to legitimately claim you are 100% green.
    It matter not one jot that Ecotricity (or any of the other Green generation outfits) “cover” their customer usage, the plain simple fact is that unitl there is a dedicated green supply grid we ALL use a mix, and there is no way we can avoid doing so, leastwise, not without going to the massive expense of our own generation capability..

    To put it slightly differently 100% of electricity customers ALSO use the 11.7% green generated electricity.. Are they also able to legitemately claim they are solely green, or is that privilege reserved for Ecotricity customers only?

    As I’ve mentioned before, I’ve lived green power for a very long time, long before the present very slow “revolution”, and quite probably long before many users of phevs and evs existed, or indeed did the actual vehicles. In all those years of patent applications and grants, research & development, fighting my corner to the very highest levels,(try Prime Ministerial and Presidential, and not missing out the odd Sheikh) and trying to break the vicious oil/fossil dominated circle the one thing I’ve learned above all else is to call a spade a spade, because sure as eggs is eggs, some anti green oil company wise*** or bureaucrat will use any dubous statement to their own advantage and put the green cause back a further 100 years, and, sad to say, claiming anyone is 100% green whilst on the National Grid is heaven sent grist to their mill.

  • #29434


    ..just read this thread and thought that it’s similar in concept to an Airline offsetting [some of] the carbon it produces by planting a bunch of trees and claiming to be Green. Still, anything is better then nowt.

  • #29752


    Perhaps Jon can help me out with a question.

    Some electrical companies are only middlemen and obviously buy electricity from someone? at one price and then sell it to end users at a mark up.

    Some companies such as Ecotricity actually have their own method of generation. I therefore assume that Ecotricity put their energy into the national grid and then charge end users as required. And I assume Ecotricitys surplus energy is just sold to the grid to be sold by other middlemen.

    I use a company that charges me 9p per kwh, but Ecotricity charges its customers a horrific 15p per kwh.

    So we are all getting electricity from the same pot in the proportions Jon stated. But different companies charge different prices. Does this mean Ecotricity charge more to put energy in the grid than EDF does?

    If this is the case then Ecotricity are making the average customer price higher, which hurts all of us.

  • #29753


    I can’t disagree with you at all Micky, and it’s more or less what I’ve been saying all along.
    On the Ecotricity front I don’t know what , or if, they receive governmental “Green”grants, but I would imagine they do, so that makes matters worse, as those grants come out of our taxes, a double whammy in effect.
    In a perfect world all generation would be renewable, but unfortunately we don’t live in a perfect world, and anyone who preaches “I use only green” really needs to look at the real electricity generation and distribution facts.
    It matters not that Ecotricity (or anyone else ) generate the same amount as their customers use. You cannot piously claim to use exclusively green electricty…… you can however legitimately claim to use 11.7% green electricity, which rather unfortunatley is precisely what I and every other National Grid electricity user in the country does.
    Using the National Grid one is as much a Nuclear generated power user as everyone else, the same for the other forms.
    As I said in an earlier post it’s the old 3 card trick……… a bit like the range trick… or the mpg trick. We all know in a perfect situation those ranges or mpg figures are obtainable. Unfotunately unlocking the car door and sitting behind the wheel reality creeps in.
    My gripe isn’t with Ecotricty, or full EV owners. My gripe is the misrepresentation of fact. It wasn’t so long ago VW played that game, and we all known the end result. If we as BEV and PHEV users start the same sort of misrepresenation it harms our cause………and believe me, there are many many “interested ” parties would love to see the downfall of the Electric revolution. One doesn’t have to be called Einstein to work it out
    Instead of snobbishly boasting ” I use only Green electricity”, and having everyone with half an ounce of common sense sneer, why not instead say
    ” Thanks to me and my friends who use EVs the atmosphere is cleaner, and you use 11.7% LESS carbon or nuclear generated fuel in your everyday life.”
    Now that IS the truth.

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